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	<title>Comments on: faith alone, and never alone</title>
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	<link>http://2mites.com/2009/09/30/faith-alone-and-never-alone/</link>
	<description>spending it all, because He is our treasure</description>
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		<title>By: Aaron Jameson</title>
		<link>http://2mites.com/2009/09/30/faith-alone-and-never-alone/comment-page-1/#comment-211</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron Jameson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 15:32:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2mites.wordpress.com/?p=312#comment-211</guid>
		<description>&quot;It is important to note that God can detect what man cannot detect.&quot;

This wasn&#039;t mentioned in class, but I desperately wanted to say it!  This is a key we often forget, and as a result, end up judging and hurting people, and coming off as extremely arrogant.  May God spare us from being quick to judge and not quick to listen (see James 1:19).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It is important to note that God can detect what man cannot detect.&#8221;</p>
<p>This wasn&#8217;t mentioned in class, but I desperately wanted to say it!  This is a key we often forget, and as a result, end up judging and hurting people, and coming off as extremely arrogant.  May God spare us from being quick to judge and not quick to listen (see James 1:19).</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Ivy</title>
		<link>http://2mites.com/2009/09/30/faith-alone-and-never-alone/comment-page-1/#comment-209</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Ivy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 03:10:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2mites.wordpress.com/?p=312#comment-209</guid>
		<description>I certainly agree with everything that you&#039;ve said in this post, Jeff.  I agree that justification is entirely by faith alone, but that a lack of good works is a damning proof of a lack of faith.

The only area in your post where I might seek greater clarity is on your line: &quot;This true faith always brings forth Christo-centric obedience. It is important to emphasize the Christ centeredness of this obedience, because that is the essence of the work that God requires.&quot;

Bottom line up front: I would use the adjective &quot;dependent&quot; or &quot;restful&quot; or &quot;believing&quot; as opposed to &quot;Christo-centric&quot;.

Explanation:  It seems to me that the &quot;essence&quot; (as you put it) of the work that God requires is not that the work be Christ centered (texts like Philippians 1:15 come to mind: &quot;Some indeed preach Christ from envy and rivalry.&quot;) but that the work be dependent upon the grace of God.  In other words, even a person trusting very much in their own talent and skill could aim to make Christ the benefactor of all their talent and skill (make their efforts centered on Christ), but it&#039;s another thing to make all your works dependent on Christ.

Caveat:  I realize that you could also be using &quot;Christo-centric&quot; in the sense that I have just described above.  In that case, I would just ask that you state what &quot;Christo-centric&quot; means (i.e. depending upon Christ) rather than assuming that people will take that as the meaning.  I could forsee many people (such as myself) thinking that &quot;Christo-centric&quot; simply means to make the fame of Christ central in your efforts (whether or not faith is the driving force).

To sum it up: overall, I think your right on and my only issue is one of clarity.  It seems clearly possible to me that a person could be motivated to work for the glory of Christ and all the while trust in themselves to glorify Christ - a practice that will eventually crush them.  Rather, we need to be Christo-centric in our goals and aspirations while also fully dying to ourselves and relying on the life of Christ in us to achieve all our Christo-centric aspirations.

I hope you find that helpful even if I read you wrong.  In that case, may it be a lesson in how badly people can mangle what you wrote! :)  Blessings to you, brother and thanks for joining me in my efforts to think this through.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I certainly agree with everything that you&#8217;ve said in this post, Jeff.  I agree that justification is entirely by faith alone, but that a lack of good works is a damning proof of a lack of faith.</p>
<p>The only area in your post where I might seek greater clarity is on your line: &#8220;This true faith always brings forth Christo-centric obedience. It is important to emphasize the Christ centeredness of this obedience, because that is the essence of the work that God requires.&#8221;</p>
<p>Bottom line up front: I would use the adjective &#8220;dependent&#8221; or &#8220;restful&#8221; or &#8220;believing&#8221; as opposed to &#8220;Christo-centric&#8221;.</p>
<p>Explanation:  It seems to me that the &#8220;essence&#8221; (as you put it) of the work that God requires is not that the work be Christ centered (texts like Philippians 1:15 come to mind: &#8220;Some indeed preach Christ from envy and rivalry.&#8221;) but that the work be dependent upon the grace of God.  In other words, even a person trusting very much in their own talent and skill could aim to make Christ the benefactor of all their talent and skill (make their efforts centered on Christ), but it&#8217;s another thing to make all your works dependent on Christ.</p>
<p>Caveat:  I realize that you could also be using &#8220;Christo-centric&#8221; in the sense that I have just described above.  In that case, I would just ask that you state what &#8220;Christo-centric&#8221; means (i.e. depending upon Christ) rather than assuming that people will take that as the meaning.  I could forsee many people (such as myself) thinking that &#8220;Christo-centric&#8221; simply means to make the fame of Christ central in your efforts (whether or not faith is the driving force).</p>
<p>To sum it up: overall, I think your right on and my only issue is one of clarity.  It seems clearly possible to me that a person could be motivated to work for the glory of Christ and all the while trust in themselves to glorify Christ &#8211; a practice that will eventually crush them.  Rather, we need to be Christo-centric in our goals and aspirations while also fully dying to ourselves and relying on the life of Christ in us to achieve all our Christo-centric aspirations.</p>
<p>I hope you find that helpful even if I read you wrong.  In that case, may it be a lesson in how badly people can mangle what you wrote! <img src='http://2mites.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />   Blessings to you, brother and thanks for joining me in my efforts to think this through.</p>
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		<title>By: Robin Lacine</title>
		<link>http://2mites.com/2009/09/30/faith-alone-and-never-alone/comment-page-1/#comment-148</link>
		<dc:creator>Robin Lacine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Oct 2009 17:09:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2mites.wordpress.com/?p=312#comment-148</guid>
		<description>I love you too Jeff, so very much.  I love your heart - what a beautiful prayer. I am going to
print this and put it on my desk.

Oh, how wonderful our loving God is.  I am forever grateful that he has gifted us
with you. May your life, your every breath bring Him glory always; may you know deep in your heart how your wanting to please Him, pleases Him and how very much He loves and cares for you.

Love, Mom</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love you too Jeff, so very much.  I love your heart &#8211; what a beautiful prayer. I am going to<br />
print this and put it on my desk.</p>
<p>Oh, how wonderful our loving God is.  I am forever grateful that he has gifted us<br />
with you. May your life, your every breath bring Him glory always; may you know deep in your heart how your wanting to please Him, pleases Him and how very much He loves and cares for you.</p>
<p>Love, Mom</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff Lacine</title>
		<link>http://2mites.com/2009/09/30/faith-alone-and-never-alone/comment-page-1/#comment-147</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff Lacine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Oct 2009 16:08:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2mites.wordpress.com/?p=312#comment-147</guid>
		<description>Mom, I love you so much.  It was good to hear your voice on the phone last night, and we are looking forward to your visit in 4 weeks!

Concerning Merton&#039;s prayer...  My differences with Merton on epistemology (among other things) are great.  A prayer like this, from my mouth, would sound much different than Merton&#039;s.  You will see many similarities, and some differences.  The differences might seem subtle, but they are, in my view, extremely important.  Here is how I might pray a prayer like the one above:

My Lord God,
It is by your grace alone that I know I am moving heavenward,  though it doesn&#039;t often feel like it
I do not see the road ahead of me
yet, I trust it will end in enjoying Your glory forever.
I know I am thoroughly wicked and undeserving, and I still do not fully perceive the depths of my depravity.  Your grace is amazing.
You keep your sheep, and discipline your children,
and I trust you to keep me on the path even when I unknowingly go astray.
Continually renew in me a heart that desires your will no matter where it may lead.
I sense in myself, now, this desire for you and your will, and I am thankful for it.
Help me not to walk through life blindly, but please oh God, reveal to me Your glory, and show me how Your glory should cause me to relate to all of life.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mom, I love you so much.  It was good to hear your voice on the phone last night, and we are looking forward to your visit in 4 weeks!</p>
<p>Concerning Merton&#8217;s prayer&#8230;  My differences with Merton on epistemology (among other things) are great.  A prayer like this, from my mouth, would sound much different than Merton&#8217;s.  You will see many similarities, and some differences.  The differences might seem subtle, but they are, in my view, extremely important.  Here is how I might pray a prayer like the one above:</p>
<p>My Lord God,<br />
It is by your grace alone that I know I am moving heavenward,  though it doesn&#8217;t often feel like it<br />
I do not see the road ahead of me<br />
yet, I trust it will end in enjoying Your glory forever.<br />
I know I am thoroughly wicked and undeserving, and I still do not fully perceive the depths of my depravity.  Your grace is amazing.<br />
You keep your sheep, and discipline your children,<br />
and I trust you to keep me on the path even when I unknowingly go astray.<br />
Continually renew in me a heart that desires your will no matter where it may lead.<br />
I sense in myself, now, this desire for you and your will, and I am thankful for it.<br />
Help me not to walk through life blindly, but please oh God, reveal to me Your glory, and show me how Your glory should cause me to relate to all of life.</p>
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		<title>By: Robin Lacine</title>
		<link>http://2mites.com/2009/09/30/faith-alone-and-never-alone/comment-page-1/#comment-146</link>
		<dc:creator>Robin Lacine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Oct 2009 14:08:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2mites.wordpress.com/?p=312#comment-146</guid>
		<description>Jeff, I am reminded once again as I look at the prayer by thomas merton on my desk -
here is part of it:
My Lord God
I have no idea where I am going
I do not see the road ahead of me.
I cannot know for certain where it will end.
Nor do I really know myself.
And the fact that I think I am following your will does
not mean that I am actually doing so.
But I believe that the desire to please you does
infact please you.
And I hope that I have that desire in all that I am doing.
And I know that if I do this, you will lead me by the
right road though i may know nothing about it.
        Therefore will I trust you always .........

Love you,
Mom</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeff, I am reminded once again as I look at the prayer by thomas merton on my desk -<br />
here is part of it:<br />
My Lord God<br />
I have no idea where I am going<br />
I do not see the road ahead of me.<br />
I cannot know for certain where it will end.<br />
Nor do I really know myself.<br />
And the fact that I think I am following your will does<br />
not mean that I am actually doing so.<br />
But I believe that the desire to please you does<br />
infact please you.<br />
And I hope that I have that desire in all that I am doing.<br />
And I know that if I do this, you will lead me by the<br />
right road though i may know nothing about it.<br />
        Therefore will I trust you always &#8230;&#8230;&#8230;</p>
<p>Love you,<br />
Mom</p>
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